Paul Lorei - Let There Be Light - Entrusted Podcast

The wonderful Susan Yurkewicz interviewed me recently for the inaugural episode of her podcast Entrusted. Check it out.

Hello and welcome to Entrusted. This is the podcast where we're talking with people who are sharing their talents with the world because the world needs what you've been given. I am so excited. If I seem giddy, it's because I am. This is the first episode where we will actually have a guest with us. So, I'm very excited. My name is Susan Yurkewicz. I'm the founder of Harbor Lily Creative. That's the organization bringing you this podcast. I'll be your host. And if you have missed, I recorded an earlier episode of this which talks a little bit more about the why and the what behind entrusted, why we're doing this podcast about talents. Uh please do go back. You'll find the link for that in the notes for this show and um catch you up to speed with with what we're doing. But as for this very special show, I am beyond thrilled to introduce you to a genius behind the camera lens, a man of great faith, a devoted father, a devoted husband, and all-around gifted creative who has a lot more going on, I think you'll find out, uh, than just what he's doing with photography. So, I'd like to welcome Paul Lorei of Lorei Portraits to the show. Welcome, Paul. Thank you. It is a delight to be here. And imagine that I'm in your on your inaugural show. I mean, it's like it just gives me chills, you know? This is awesome. It's exciting, isn't it? It really is. It really is. Well, I'm I'm thrilled that it is you that's here because I have long been an admirer of your work. I just um there's you offer a lot more than most people would find in an average portrait studio, I would say, and I'm excited to kind of get into that and how you landed. Um well first of all with photography but also with the special uh effects that you do with your work. Um if we could get started though I do have a quick question and that's just that did photography come naturally to you? Is this something that you knew you always wanted to be doing? Uh well really I started out in the advertising business and I got fired at my first job. I got fired at my second job and I did a lot of Yes. This is going to be exciting. Okay. And I just I I read a book called What Color Is My Parachute? And I realized something that I knew when I was four years old. And that was that I wanted to be an artist, but I didn't know how to start. I wasn't trained as an artist. And um I worked for another ad agency. And then my father asked me to work for him as a photographer. He is a school pictures or was a school pictures photographer. And when I um it's just funny when I look back when I was in college, I made friends with photographers. When I was out of college and uh working every ad agency I ever worked at, and I worked at three of them, I always made friends with photographers. So, I didn't even realize I was circling it until, you know, I started working for my dad and I'm doing school pictures photography, which is the most grueling every, you know, it's almost the same every time. It's be like flipping McDonald's burgers like over and over and over again. It's just so hard. But I I learned a lot and it was my intro and it was my kind of like venue into the business. My goal was to write the great American novel. So, I worked for my father for four years and I decided to go back and uh finish up a master's degree uh in English. And um when I was in grad school, we had two kids and soon we had four. And I was making we were making $8,000 a year and we had a mortgage and we had college payments. And I just went to the PR office one day with a portfolio of some images that I did. And for some reason they gave me a a they gave me an assignment and I started doing some photography for Ganon University in town. And then I started working for Mercyhurst uh college at the time, soon to be university. Then I started doing um reunion group photos. Then I started doing weddings. Then I started doing families. And then four years later, I realized I had a whole business. I don't have my novel done yet, but I I had a whole business going. And so 35 years later, here I am uh still still standing. So that was that was the entry in. That is incredible. That is incredible. So were you did somebody have to train you how to do photography? Like you worked with your dad? Was he your Yeah. your mentor. Well, I certainly learned a lot working for my father, but I have to say photography is one of the strangest vocations of them all because I know many professional photographers and so many of the very most successful and talented photographers I know were not trained in photography. They came at it from another from another area of study. I I met a guy that was a physician, one guy was a chemist. I know a guy that was a flew uh he was an airline pilot. I I've known people just doing a whole variety of different things. It's the kind of thing with an artist, you have to have something just kind of like writing here that's just eating at you. I mean, I look back and I go, why did I get fired for my first two jobs? It's because like I just was wanted to do something creative and if I wasn't doing something creative, I wasn't happy. And so I wasn't I wasn't really a good employee. to be honest. I mean, I I hate to say it, but I deserve to be fired. I mean, I was probably lucky I didn't get fired from my quit. I quit before they got a chance to fire me. I was like, I know what's coming next. You're going to fire me. So, um but uh yeah, but so anyways, in answer your question, so I you know, I took a countless numbers of seminars and I read books and I got books from the library and I learned from my father and I learned through through trial and error. And the whole thing is in the photography world if you can create salailable images and wrap a business around it then the whole thing kind of comes together. But there are professional organizations like Professional Photographers of America which was very helpful and I would go to their annual seminars um and like I said read books, tapes, CDs, go to seminars and I would just you know sit at the feet of whoever was teaching and just love it just like oh this is great you know and then go back to the studio and try to recreate it. So it's it's fun. When I was a kid I wanted to be a painter and I think if I lived in a different age I would have been a painter. I mean, I'm I I'm doing painting now these days, you know, just at at uh doing kind of real paint. I'm also doing digital painting, too. That's so exciting. So, what I'm hearing you say, though, is that this was calling you. I mean, you worked at an ad agency, which some people would find creative, but for you, that wasn't it. You knew that you weren't being fulfilled in some way. Oh, it was it was it was very difficult. Yeah. I and I I went into advertising because it was the most creative end at least I thought it was the most creative end of business and it just wasn't really a fit. So yeah, I have to say Sue, it really was a calling. I mean I looking back it's really easy to see I was circling photography circling photography for probably you know four years before I before I finally took the plunge and got behind the camera. Okay, that I was going to ask about that. Was there a tipping point that was it for you that you were like, "All right, I'm going all in. This wasn't a side hustle anymore. You were going to make a business out of this?" I think a four years after I started the the little side hustle and all of a sudden I had a full-blown business and was like, "Okay, I I wasn't planning on this. I wasn't expecting this. this wasn't my, you know, my long-term plan, but I'm pretty good at it and I like it. So, and I if I can make money at it, like, wow, this is great. You know, can imagine that doing something creative, making something beautiful and then people pay you for it. Like, what could be better? Like, this is awesome. Absolutely. Absolutely. So, I want to ask when you realized that this was a talent of yours, did you struggle at all with um the confidence behind that or you it was over time that that built up for you? I'm thinking in terms of you were able to find a talent that you were able to make a living at. And I'm sure there are people that will be listening kind of have this thought in their mind, I'd like to do that. I don't know if I'm good enough. you know, I mean, as far as encouraging people to utilize their talent because this is a gift that they've been given and how can they make the world better by using their talent? That's that's it. That's kind of the magic. That's a mix right there. Yeah, that's such a good question. You know, I think so many of us as all almost everybody I've ever met, but especially creatives, we're all filled with self-doubt. We don't think we're good enough. we're not either smart enough or we don't have the right pedigree or we don't didn't come from the right zip code or whatever the you know it's somehow just not enough and then you also have this imposttor syndrome where one thinks oh my gosh you know like why would you buy from me you know it's like I'm not how how could that be that you would even consider me but then the the big advantage I had was that I had I had three mouths to feed and then soon five. And so it's like, okay, either you make money at this and you make salailable images or you've got to find another way to make money. And so it was, you know, um, necessity is the mother of invention in my case. So I I think it's tough to jump in the water. You know, the the water is like, wow, I don't know if I'm good enough. I don't know if I'm good enough. I think if somebody's standing on the sidelines, you just go if there's not a necessity, I think it is harder to just jump in the pool and swim. But it's like I just that was the only Can I tell you one story? Please do. I came uh I'm in grad school. I uh I come back home one day. My wife's got two little kids, pregnant with a third child. Uh we had um we we ran out of money. And she said, "I don't have enough money to pay the electric bill." And I said, "Really?" I said, "Did you look around the house? Did you look for any change? Is there anything else?" And she goes, "No." He goes, "We like I mean I might be able to scrape together $25." So I said, "Okay." And the electric bill wasn't that much. I think it was like $36. So, I I did something I always said I would do if I really got desperate. I went to Palacos Chocolates. I bought a box of fundraiser chocolates and you buy them for 25 bucks and you get whatever you know or you you get you get 25 bars for, you know, 1250 or something like that and you sell them for a buck a piece. And I went down to Ganon where I was in grad school and I hawkked chocolate bars one afternoon. That's how that's how that's how you do what you got to do. I mean, oh my gosh, I still think of that. And then what college kid doesn't like chocolate? There's got to be a better way. There's got to be some way that I can that I can make a go of this. So um so the photography was because I you know because I had I knew the basics of photography and every ad agency I ever worked at they always trusted me. I think everyone always instinctively recognized that I had a very good eye a visual eye like I could see what worked visually proportions what looked good color composition I just had it. So, I think that I I had enough confidence there that if I'm behind the camera, I can pull that off. So, that picture that just flashed up there, by the way, that wasn't my younger self. In case in caseing you're thinking, man, that guy was handsome when he was young. Look at how ugly he is now. He lost all his hair. Okay. So, so go ahead, Susan. Well, I was curious. So your wife then um and I love your wife. She was supportive during this time. Yes. As far as saying Okay. So she recognized she was very supportive. Yeah. So we we really um just just had the this this trust that everything was going to work out. I'm not going to say that I we weren't worried that we weren't frightened. Um, but we always had, you know, I think, you know, if I I was completely desperate, you know, we probably could have gone to my parents or her parents and ask them for some money, but we never did. You know, that was never that was never the plan. So I I I always felt like if I just, you know, can create a few products um and and specialize in a few things. The the my first big breakthrough was I was doing a lot of um class reunions. So we would do these um we would I would look up in the newspaper when a class reunion was coming up. I would call up the person that was putting it together and then I would show up at the event. I would take a picture of the group and then I'd take a then I would hand out envelopes, numbered envelopes to all of the people and they would write their name on it and then they held up the number the back side of the envelope underneath their chin. It had the number on it and then I took a picture of that. So everybody in the group holding a number and then I had them pass the envelopes back into me oftentimes with with check or cash that they were buying a photo from. And then I was able to put their names on the bottom of the of the photo. And that was so valuable to the reunion. So I could go on a on a weekend on a really good weekend. I remember I mean $2,000 one time on a weekend. This is way back 35 years ago. I'm like, "Yes." You know, like we're not going to starve this month. Oh my gosh. So it was uh it was great. I kind of created this whole system and but it was out of necessity. like I got to figure out a way to to to make money. But you know, many things in photography that I, you know, that while it's nice to make money, I still had a a fire burning in my belly to create and as remember I was telling you how hard it was to take school pictures. I I always have a my vision of hell is that I'm stuck behind a school pictures uh camera and one squirmy child comes onto the stool after another and uh it's like the class sort of never ends and I finally go out in the hallway and I look down the hallway and the hallway snakes on forever, you know? So like that's but but I also learned something in in taking school pictures. I one I learned that I didn't want to do that for the rest of my life. But the other thing that I learned was that at one point it struck me. I I can I can remember, you know, like the moment like I'm photographing one child after another and I'm looking at their faces and I'm kind of setting them up on the camera and you in school pictures you have to he had to get a new child on the stool like every 60 seconds. Boom. Boom. Boom. Boom. And it was gruelingly hard work. And it was the same, the same, the same. But I was, as I'm looking at all of the children's faces, it struck me. I'm like, "Oh my gosh, that child is so beautiful." And the next child that sat in the store, "My gosh, that child is so beautiful. My gosh, that child, my gosh, like every one of these children is so beautiful. They all are different, but they're so beautiful." And that's how I came up with the slogan for our business, which is every face is beautiful. So, oh, I love that. I love that. Thank you. Thank you. Yeah. So, that is actually a great jumping point because I was going to ask, what part has your faith played in your talent journey as far as maybe guiding which way you go? Obviously, in the way that you're seeing each child as an individual and so unique and the beauty in each child. So, um very very good question. Uh the um hang let me hang off for a second to my wife. Okay, good. Very good question. Um I remember um you know when I would photograph uh class reunions or or you know or children you know high schoolers you know in many ways it was kind of mercenary work. But as I came to kind of like appreciate the beauty of each individual, but I think my breakthrough was when I started photographing weddings and I just thought this is really really important what I'm doing. This couple asked me to photograph their wedding and I'm going to do the best possible job that I can do. So, I would always pray on my way down to whatever, you know, church or that I was or venue that I was going to photograph them and I would pray for the couple and I I would think I would pray aloud too just to get my voice warmed up. Um, but I I took it as a, you know, very much as a vocation like this is like like I always looked at my job in a wedding and is like, okay, the flowers could be wilty. The food could be a little bit cold or not just right. There could be something wrong with a hall, but if the pictures are wrong, they're wrong forever. Sure. I thought I have to do a good job. So, I always had a backup system for everything. And I always just said, I'm going to give them the best possible, you know, wedding photos that I can give them. I'm going to give them my whole self, my all my talents. And so, it was, you know, it was it was a it was a bit of a calling. I did weddings for 23 years. And um I uh I you know I I still come back to the to our our tagline and I think of every face as beautiful. So I you know it's it's very much you know we're all made in the image and likeness of God and I just think I get to do two things that are I get to do like three things that are really cool. One is um you know what's the first thing that God created you know in the Bible? He created light. Well, what does photography mean? It means drawing with light. Photo means light. Graphy is to draw. So, you're drawing with light. So, I get to work with his first creation. Isn't that cool? That is really cool. Isn't that cool? And so and then it's like, you know, I just, you know, oftentimes I'll look at the clouds and I'll see, you know, the way the clouds, you know, move and the the different shapes and the colors and the way the light plays through them. And I was like, I always say, the painter is at work again. The painter's at work again. And I'm like, wow, I get to create. And God was a, you know, is a creator. So I was like, this is a special gift. And then of course as I get to you know I got to work with these you know these different families and so it was um it's really been a um such a such a blessing. I I look back and I just can't see myself plugging into an organization and just being an employee. I guess I always tell people I was the world's worst employee. So don't hire me whatever you do. I mean, at least hire me as photographer. But so, um, yeah. Well, I mean, what a courageous step, though. I think you knew that deep down inside yourself, and I I'm sensing in the world today that there are just so many people that do just go after making a living. Maybe I I feel like they have to know in their heart. they've come across some things that they know they're good at or or it calls to them like it called to you and and I would absolutely say you're right. I always recogn I should shouldn't say always but recognize the sky. I I love that. I do believe that that is some way that God is just reminding us of first of all he is creative and that's just his little gift to us every morning, every night. You know, of course, in some part of the world sometimes it's cloudy, but even in the clouds. We were driving home from a lacrosse game the other night and it was just artistic. I mean, it was in the way that the underside of the clouds were lit with pinks and just and I have this thing where I'm driving by. Um I wish that I I'm so interested. I want to hear about your painting, but I can't help but deconstruct um and I'm not a painter uh fields of flowers when I'm driving by. I'm always like, I would not have thought to put purple and yellow together and yet it works. Yeah. Who would have thought, you know? So, I'm I'm curious as far as your the the eye that you have and what you have done with your photography in some of the family photos and um I've seen a lot on the beach and I've seen just different placements that you've put people in. Would you say that your vocation as a husband, as a father helps you when you're working with families? Like does that give you a certain kind of insight or has that guided you creatively? Yeah, that a great question. Very very much so. Um the um uh I noticed when I'm working with families in it was true for weddings and was very true for families. I have a huge leg up on other uh you know other photographers um just in the sense that I come from a family of 10. I have seven brothers and two sisters. So I grew up with a bit of chaos and I am comfortable with chaos. I can thrive in chaos. And the the other thing that was so good um in weddings is I was really taught to um uh I was really taught or I I I learned how to immediately take command of an entire uh auditorium or or church or and just like call out to the people and say, "Okay, I need everybody to do this." And then uh like 30 seconds later, I could also pivot and become a fly on the wall and just like invisible. And I was always this sort of like master of ceremonies, fly on the wall, master of ceremonies, fly on the wall. And then when I'm photographing a family, for example, at the beach, I can be I I can I can charm children like that, you I can I I know how to like I can I I just say look I tell the I tell the family I says look the tail wags the dog. I say you're going to see that when we get to doing the family portrait I'm going to spend most of my time charming your children because my philosophy is if I charm the children the adults will follow. And that's the truth. So I just focus I laser focus on those kids. If I have to get down to their level, if I have to get silly with them and I can get them as soon as the kids buy in, the parents buy in because every parent is so worried that their kids going to misbehave during the photo shoot. Like, Johnny, sit up straight. No, Johnny, smile. Smile. Would you smile? You know, and it's just crazy. So, it can be so stressful. It's like it doesn't need to be stressful. It's like it's like look, you get dressed, we do the rest. I'm going to I'm just going to I'm just going to I'm going to be like pied piper with your kids and I'm just going to charm them and then I get them to buy in and then the parents the parents buy in then too like oh he's fine you know like I don't have to do much here this kid's and then boom and and then the thing is there's in photography you have to and this I think is an advantage of you know of being a father and we have five kids it's like this whole idea of of serendipity. I mean, there is chaos. There is chaos in family. There is somebody that all of a sudden cries and somebody won't, you know, won't sit in this spot or or refuses to be over on this side of the equation when they want to be on the other side of the equation or whatever it is. And it's like, okay, well, you have to pivot. You just have to go, okay, we're gonna figure this out and and I'm not gonna get rattled. Because as soon as you get rattled, as soon as as the photographer gets rattled, then the child gets nervous, the parents get rattled, and the whole thing falls apart, right? So, it you just have to just be like, "This is awesome. It doesn't matter. It's okay." And I I'm really I'm like it's like it's like water a duck's back. I'm like I'm not the least bit, you know, not the least bit concerned. It sounds like you're using many talents. You know, photography is is the main talent, but you have this talent of interpersonal skills. You have this talent of charming children and therefore their parents. Yeah. I mean, well, no, absolutely. So look it to to run a a business one needs to be able to what's the what's the common phrase they say like emotionally mature or something like that or there's a there's a common phrase I can't think of it right off is you you have to be able to read where people are very quickly and to understand are are they you know do they want to be here do they not want to be here are they being kind of stoic are they you know are they are they silly already you And so and then you have to then you have to you know dive in and uh you know so and you have to have you have to have those people skills to be able to do what you need to do behind the camera. So and camera and you know and lighting and posing and everything is you know it's like whatever 30% of the whole you know 20 30% of the whole shoot and match. There's a lot of components that go to it. So Right. Right. Yeah. So, can I ask what are you most excited about uh in your photography uh these days? Wow. Very interesting. So, um about you know I I love photography but like I said if you know if if I lived life over again I I very much think I would uh if I lived in a different age I would have been a painter. I'm convinced of it. But um I live in this age so like I always like photography but I always felt kind of like a little bit hemmed in by it because if I get a chance to go to a museum uh say Cleveland Museum of Art is a awesome museum and I go up there probably about once a year. Um I you know let's say there's a photography exhibit and there's a painting exhibit. Nine times out of 10, I will go right for the painting. So, I know it seems counterintuitive, but to my mind, I look at painters and I'm like, okay, painters have been at this for what, 2500 years. Photography has only been around for 150 years or whatever the math is. So, 175 years. Um, so I think it's about 150 years. So, um I I I feel like they worked everything out. So, everything I need to know about lighting, composition, color, harmony, um expression, it's like they already worked it out and they're in many ways more advanced. So, it's like I go study from painters. I'm like, just give me the painting, show me the paint. And that's what I that's what I look for. And so, so I I look at what they do and it's like that's who I learn from. That's who I you know, I sit at their feet. So, it's like I I admire photographers. I learn from photographers, but if I if I'm going to study from uh somebody, if I'm going to study somebody that's really great. Now, there's a couple there's a couple exceptions in photography that I you know, I will stop everything, but for the most part, paint painters, I mean, you know, great great painters. Now, aren't you doing something where you're blending your love of painting with your photography? So about 20 years ago, we started doing um some digital painting, which I was just so excited about because now it's last I can I'm I'm a little bit less hemmed in and I can start to do something that's a little bit more creative and I can I can blend things and make it a little more painterly. And then in um very recently, so we're kind of doing um these mixed media pieces that are are photography and then they're uh some uh AI generated backgrounds like that one there. That's that's beautiful. Isn't that beautiful? I just did that last week. Um that one's nice. That's a straight photograph right there. Um and there's any of that. Isn't that lovely? That one I did that one back in 2017. Isn't that beautiful? Um, so, um, so more recently, put up that one. Um, that's a lovely one, too. Put the one up with the the dancer. She's got the red cape flying behind her. She's um out kind of like in the sky. Um, go back. No, she's got a big red cape behind her. It should be in that group somewhere. Um, let's If you go Yeah. Scroll down. And it's the third one down on the right hand column. That one if you can click on that. Yeah. So this to me was this is a really nice breakthrough piece that we created um about a year ago. And so this is photography. Thank you. This photography this is this is a bit of AI and then this is a digital painting. And it's like we've managed to weave all three of them together. The girl is very realistic in life like she was photographed in the studio. My wife is actually throwing up that big red cape behind her and um you know and then through the the wonders of you know generative backgrounds and we were able to create something that is what I would call fantastic like fantastical realism. Uh it's really fine art fine art portraiture in a kind of in a different realm. So, so much of that creativity. Oh my word. So, that's just really fun. I mean, it's like, wow. You know, like this is awesome. So, I'm I'm very u I'm very excited about it. It's um you know it's and and and and the same time that I'm you know that I'm doing that I'm also um I I when I I started um with a um there's an online academy called New Masters Academy and they teach all kinds of uh painting and drawing like traditional painting and drawing. So I started taking classes about three years ago or just like you know cherry-picking classes. So I started doing drawing, used to draw a ton as a kid. And so now I I really worked on drawing for a year and a half, two years. And now I'm really jumping into painting right now. And I'm painting with, you know, with real paint u and um real oils and and that's very fun. And so then what we're doing, I should say this with, you know, like with the with that piece with the girl with the red cape, what we're doing now is we're we're adding um brush strokes and we're adding texture to the surface of pieces. So it's it's just um it's so much fun. And um I I always think I keep sort of like changing a little bit what I do. And I always wonder, you know, what my clients think of me like, well, I thought he was a headshot photographer. I thought he was a senior photographer and but you know and I thought he was a wedding photographer. It's kind of like I keep changing my hats and I I I don't know if I like confused the marketplace but I'm I'm just having fun. No, what's cool about that though? You're you're leaning into where your interests are and that's taking you to a place of being novel in an industry that so much of it could be the same. But I I believe it's causing you to stand out. you are you're pushing the limits more by following your interest in painting by following um something that's been in you in the same way that you were drawn more toward a creative field and you went in that direction and now within that field you're still being drawn more toward painting and that's something that you've said you've always been interested in. I love that forever. I mean, I when I was like eight years old, I thought I'm going to be a painter. And then, you know, when you grow up in a family of 10 and it's like, what's the adjective they always put in front of artist? Starving. I want to say gonna say crazy. So, I was like, I don't want to be a starving artist. When when they ask you, you know, what do you want to study in college? You know, I was like, oh, I don't know. So, um, can I tell you one story? I do. So, so when I was in high school and they, you know, how they take those aptitude tests and um where you find out your interest and they'll ask you, you know, would you rather like tie, you know, sticks in bundles or clean bedpants, you know, would you rather, you know, uh, I don't know, you know, shovel the walk or, you know, make phone calls, you know, like I'm just I'm reading through this and I'm like, this is the dumbest test of all time. I'm like, I don't want to do any of these things. I like this is awful. I'm like, but I I know what I want to do, you know? So, I'm this is when I'm 17, my my my goal is a little bit different. So, so I'm Anyways, I'm sitting there across from the guidance counselor, um, Father Cruz, and um, he says to me, Paul, um, you know, you seem like a, you know, a bright young man, but tell me, is anything wrong at home? I said, no. He said, "You know, you didn't break up with a girlfriend or something." Like, oh, no. And I'm like, "What? What? What is, father?" He goes, "Well, I just, you know, I just just checking, you know." So, he says, "Well, you know, I think I've got the career for you." And I said, "Really?" And he said, "Yeah." And he's looking at a sheet and he's got his finger on a particular career. He said, "I think you should be a funeral home director. almost died like a funeral home director. My tail, you know, sinks between my legs and I'm like, "Oh my gosh." Like I don't want to be a funeral home director. I mean, nothing against funeral home directors. I have that they're my friends, but it's like, oh no. And then I'm I leave the room and I'm thinking maybe it's my destiny. I will become a funeral home director. So anyways, I when he was saying that when he's saying I know what you should be, I'm thinking in my head, go ahead, say it, father. You think I should be a cartoonist, don't you? Go ahead. Say it. Cartoonist. Go ahead. I know what you're gonna say. Go ahead. Cartoonist. So close. So close. So Soh, so here I am. I'm not a funeral home director, but neither am I a cartoonist, but So that's great. That is great. Well, you had mentioned before about you also wanted to write a novel. I know that you've dabbled in that a little bit. Do you mind talking about that? Sure. Sure. Sure. So, when you know before I got married, this is like I was just a year or two out of college, I just had I read a few novels that just really knocked my socks off. And one of one of them was uh a separate piece by John Nolles, which is such a great novel. I thought this is fabulous. And then I read another one like a year or two later, A Confederacy of Dunes by John Kennedy Tulle and I thought, "Wow, that is a fabulous novel. I want to be a writer. I want to be a novelist. That's what I want to be. I want to be a a novelist. I want to be a writer." So anyways, get married, you know, I have kids and um I had started on a masters in English down in uh Tyler, Texas about halfway through and that's when I kind of made a pivot, moved back north to Erie, took a job with my father and I was only halfway through the program. Worked for my father for four years. He wanted me to take over the school pictures business, but I just didn't want to be behind the school pictures camera. He asked me every which way to take over the business. I just said, "Dad, I just can't I just can't do it." You let him know that that felt like your piece of hell. Yeah. I Well, I don't know if I told him that story. So, uh, so anyways, I you know, I I read novels right and left and and after four years, I thought, "Okay, this is my chance. They have a teaching assistant program down at Gan. I'm going to apply for it." And I got the teaching assistantship. And so, that meant I could go to grad school for free and get a stipen. But, you know, going to school for free and getting a stipen of $8,000 a year with a mortgage and college payments and, uh, you know, just food and, you know, utilities. Like, it's just like that the math doesn't work. So, um, but anyways, that was my big opportunity and I thought this is going to be the path. I'm going to, you know, I'll I'll be a novelist. But once you get realistic about writing novels, just go, man, there's very very few people the whole in the whole country that are actually making a living as a novelist. So um but anyways, I started writing then and I used to tell my children um bedtime stories every night. I used to tell them Jimmy Wiggle stories and the the story always started the same. You know, uh one day Jimmy Wiggle came home from school. It was a day like any other day but somehow different. And then he would go out into his backyard and there he would encounter the nefarious Professor Wolfman. And Professor Wolfman um was this aerodite, that brilliant uh wolf who uh who stood upright uh and uh wore a burgundy dinner jacket and he would um always be out to best Jimmy, but Jimmy, you know, by the end of the little story, the bedtime story would always outdo them. and um and the kids loved it. And so I thought, I've got to write the ultimate Jimmy Wiggle story. That's what I've got to do. So I set about to write it and it was just going to be a short story. And as I was writing it, you know, I saw different scenes are coming into my head and I'm thinking, "Oh, this is good." And I I wrote it for a couple of years and then um uh probably two, three, four years. and I made some good progress, but I realized it was more than a short story. It was a novella. And then I realized, no, it's not a novella. It's a full children's novel. And then uh just life happened. Like kids are growing up. You know, we end up with five kids. And um I I worked on it a little bit here and a little bit there, but the business has taken over. I've got to take care of my clients. We got to put food on the table. I've got mouths to feed. And um I let it sit for a number of years and then I I um I called up my good friend Greg Schler and I said, "Hey, I've got a I've got this novel I'm I'm working on. I just want to read it to your family." So I did a reading at their house. And it wasn't done, but they I mean loved it. You could, this is like whatever 12 or 13 or 14 years later. You could talk to any of those kids, ask them about Jimmy Wiggle and Professor Wolfman and Luggers Delight, the the soft drink that they drank. I mean, they'll they'll and Goggle Rays, they'll tell you all about it. So, I I it was so gratifying to me like I I really do have a story here. This is a good story. But then life happened again and I'm getting kids through college and um and meanwhile Greg Schlleer is calling me every you know six you know eight months is Paul is that novel done yet? Greg you know like I'm working on it a little bit here and there but you know gosh but he he didn't give up. Paul how's Jimmy Wiggle coming? How's Jimmy Wiggle? Paul, how's Jimmy Wick? So, I I um so I I really made a very concerted effort, especially these last two years. So, I really finished the whole manuscript. I've got a whole manuscript and I've got it out to couple people to to read right now and I'm getting u getting feedback, but now I'm exploring the whole publishing uh universe and um discovering how difficult it is. Yes. And I I just thinking, okay, how can I navigate this? That's what I'm working on right now in addition to, you know, running a business and doing painting and reading and all this. So, but anyways, I'm it's I I think it's a good story. I mean, who knows, you know, um uh there's you ran it by kids and they love it. I mean, would it is a children's story or you think adults? Yeah, it's Yeah. middle-rade fiction. Yeah. So, so fantastical realism essentially. Yeah. So, essentially there's missing children from a neighborhood. Um, there's a mysterious boy that shows up one day in Jimmy's backyard. Um, and through a series of events, they have this football that ends up getting lost in the woods. Jimmy gets in the woods and realizes that some the woods are far far deeper than he ever imagined. There's just just a handful of trees, but these woods go on forever. And um eventually uh he gets captured. He encounters the nefarious Professor Wolfman. And Professor Wolfman has this incredible uh underground complex with tunnels that go all over the world. And uh he um he's I don't want to give away too much, but he also he also um you know he's he's a megalomaniac and he's you know hoping to in various ways take over the world but he's ultimately responsible for these um we find out a little bit later these missing children. self. Um, so anyways, it's a it's in its core it's it's a wolf story, but it's also a story about um um a boy who um is um the the the working title right now is the great almoster. And uh Jimmy is a is a boy that uh he almost wins but he doesn't. He almost succeeds but he doesn't. He almost does this but he doesn't. So he's the great almoster. So, um, so anyways, I I think it's a fun story. I think the characters are are lively and engaging and and very, um, uh, I think they're delightful and and the closest thing that I could compare it to would be a r doll novel, say Charlie in the Chocolate Factory or the Big Friendly Giant or Matilda, you know, one of those. Yeah. Yeah. Well, you'll have to keep us posted. Okay. And when it's released, we want to hear all about it. Okay. Can't wait to tell you. You Nobody will be more excited than than yours truly to get that thing. That's awesome. That is awesome. It just sounds like you bleed creativity. There's so many areas that you could go in any different direction. So, that's a You have an embarrassment of riches. Yeah. Well, thank you. I I have to tell you this. I you know, I turned 65 last year. I'm going to turn 66 next month. And so many of my uh classmates and peers have retired and I I'm still working and I'm still working full-time. And I I always ask them, I say, you know, tell me how's that retirement going? And I get one of two answers. One is either I love it. Best thing I ever did in my life. I'd recommend it for everybody. And the second answer is, well, you know, I'm still kind of working on that. And I'm just thinking, you know, maybe I should go back and work for part-time a little bit. You know, I'm driving my wife crazy and I and they just don't know what to do with themselves. And I think, oh my goodness. Um that's uh that's a tragedy. Um I I can think of a hundred things that I want to do. I'm hoping you find your purpose in retirement. Um, right. But, um, I'm, you know, it's like, and for me, it's like if I give up on photography and creativity right now, what I'm afraid of is I'm gonna, you know, go off the shelf, you know, because like I, when I get in the studio and I'm photographing somebody, I'm just having fun and my clients are having fun and we're getting great images. Like, what could be better? This is awesome. So, I'm like, I don't want to I don't want to I don't want to hang up my hat when I'm at the top of my game. So, there you go. There you go. So, I'm curious, um, kind of wrapping things up here, what kind of advice would you offer someone who is thinking about leaning in the direction of going with something that they feel called to more so than just kind of doing their time and making a living in that way? That's a really, really good question. Um, being an artist is a is a faith walk in the sense that you step out into the void. You don't know. You don't have a paycheck that comes every week or every month. You don't have residuals. You You are a, you know, for lack of a better term, you're like a lion and you're hungry. Not to say that my clients I'm eating my clients, but it's like you you're looking for a meal, you know, that you live off for a while and then you you go to the next one. So, it's it's a very uneven way to go about life. I mean, of course, there are photographers that are fabulously wealthy, but most of them um struggle. So, I think the the calling of the artist is a is really a faith walk. you you it's kind of like you you are you are you are stepping out into the I'm going to do this you are stepping out into the void and every time you step you know it's like God's fingertips you know come up you know underneath you and and and that's how you you survive because like this has happened like year after year I always have like slow times year I'm like oh my gosh my clients all hate me the phone's not ringing you know this is we're going to go under, you know, it's like, no. And then something happened. I mean, something like that just happened today, but it's like, oh my goodness. So, you have you have to you really have to just trust. And it's it's very hard, but my goodness, if you really have a calling to be an artist, I would just say lean into it. And um and don't don't count the cost. And what I mean by that is I mean, of course, you have to take into consideration your economics. And I don't mean to spend all your money. I just mean like carve out some time, do this thing that really moves you and moves your heart and and fills you and just keep going kind of like one step at a time because it's kind of like you're you're you're driving through the fog. And as you're going through the fog, you start to see new vistas that you couldn't see unless because if you stop, you never see that vista. But if you keep going a little farther like, "Oh, look at that. Oh, look at that." So, uh, it it's um, beautiful. It is. I mean, you've been doing this how many how many years now? I've been Well, I was in the advertising business for 5 years, but I've been a photographer for 35 years. This is our 35th anniversary. And you know what you're talking about. Words of wisdom. Yeah, I hope so. That's a great encouragement. That really is. Well, thank you so much. This has been amazing. This has been amazing. Um I'm Kent, I'm just going to add this because I do want to talk about this whether we add this or not. I definitely um I met So I've known you for a number of years too, but I wanted to talk about our experience with though you're not with now to sleep. Sure. Sure. Yeah. But God has used your talents, I can say, in our life. Uh, specifically, you were a volunteer with an organization, now I lay me down to sleep. And we were the recipients of your talent. Uh, we had a little boy that lived two days. And how hard that must have been for you, I'm thinking, I don't know. But, uh, the organization uh, provides volunteer photographers. And I don't know if you want to speak about it a little bit, explain and then I would love to talk about how it impacted our family. Sure. Sure. So, um, now I Lay Me Down to Sleep is, um, really all about, as you said, providing photography for parents who have just lost a child either at birth or just after that. And, um, it it really is a a beautiful service. And the photographers do all of their work for free and they just provide something to the parents, these grieving parents who were expecting to go home with, you know, with their bundle of joy and they they have sadness and I did that and I don't um so we lost a baby at birth. So, it was our it was our fifth child and um my wife didn't do any sonograms beforehand. All of our other kids were healthy. Why wouldn't the fifth one be healthy? The baby's born and the color just didn't really he didn't pick up very well. So they took the baby away and then the um there was a flurry of nurses you know moving about and all a sudden I found out the baby was in the intensive care and then there's a number of nurses and there's a number of doctors and then kind of the head doctor comes out and says to me uh you know I just want to let you know your baby is very ill and we we're going to fly him down to children's hospital And in so many words, they just said we we don't know if they'll make it. So, uh, they released my wife from the hospital, which is a miracle in itself. And we drove down and our little Dominic died in our arms. So, that, you know, after that happened, I that's why especially I volunteered or now I lay me down to sleep. I hope to be of of help to other families. So, I I I'm I'm not doing it right now. Not because I don't think it's a good organization. I just got so busy. And I don't know if that's a good excuse or a poor excuse, but that's Well, everything for a season in time. I mean, I I just want to say thank you again. Um because it when you go through something like that like our family did um and having those photographs sometimes you feel like um it's such uh well as as the mom you're in this different mind frame and you're dealing with all of the emotions. And so now I'm so grateful I have those photographs because it does um I can pour over his face in that way and I can um it's a reminder. Yes, this really did happen. He was here. He was in my arms. I think had I not had those photographs, it would have felt like a blur, a distant, you know, memory because it was so emotional and traumatic. Um, and yet the pictures are beautiful. You used your talent and brought joy in that area that was a really dark spot for us. But also, um, just a true testimony to every life being sent for a purpose. And even what you said that um, every face is beautiful. I look at that and I see the beautiful face of my son who is still part of our family. um though in heaven he's still part of our family and we have his photographs. I actually have one behind us just you know he's he's there with all the other kids. So, I just want to say thank you for that again and just how interesting how God uses your talents in different ways and in different seasons and in different um scenarios from weddings to, you know, I mean, it's just not something people would typically think of maybe um death. But what a a beautiful moment to capture. I mean, it it's it's kind of hard to put into words. Yeah. You know, but it what why I think that's so particularly important is that when that child dies, I just think in years past, they would just take the baby away and the mother was left to grieve with no picture, nothing. And at least she has a picture that she can say, "Ah, this is this is my baby, right? you know, right? And and it's I think it just helps the whole grieving process. It's like let's not let's grieving is is essential to living. Yeah. Through that experience and also, you know, having gone through the death of my father, my sister, I just how much death is part of life. It's so such an interesting transition. There's so much we could talk about with that, but yeah. So, just thank you again for sharing your talent. Um, thank you for sharing the stories with us tonight. That's so exciting. Thank you. Yeah. And I'm sure we'll have your information, contact information if anybody would like to get in touch with you, has questions or would like to further um, you know, hear about what you've got going on and some of the artwork. I'm curious, do you work with anybody that's not local? Have you had people that you could um I don't know like I'm thinking about touching up their photographs in a sense like with the AI work. Are there things that you could do if it's if they're not local? Oh, absolutely. Because um because of what we're able to do creatively now, I I I have so many more tools in my tool chest that I didn't have. So, I I just need to see the see the portrait or see what you've got. Um, but uh yeah, I there's so many more things I can do. So, so yes, we would yeah, we would love to work with somebody um long distance. Absolutely. Okay, perfect. Well, thank you so much. This has been a wonderful first guest episode. Oh, thank you. Thank you. Thank you. What a delight. I'm I'm thrilled. It's awesome. Thank you. Well, thank you everybody for joining us on Entrusted, uh the podcast where we're talking with people who are putting their talents in the world, sharing them for the good of the world. Uh we do hope that you will tune in again. And uh I'm just so grateful. I'm grateful for your time, Paul, and thank you for and I'm just grateful for the audience tonight. This has been really wonderful.